The bayonet blade is hand forged from high carbon, tempered steel. New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast, More posts from the AskHistorians community. $16.80 shipping. Sword bayonets were popularly attached to “Baker Rifles.” On the other hand, a Confederate bayonet does not have the same standardization in markings. What is the dia. $30.00 shipping. A triangular bayonet causes no more injury than an equally sized bullet wound Triangular bayonets are legal, just don't mount them on a rifle. Lots of threads mention that the profuse bleeding was just an added bonus. Identify the shape and size of Civil War-era bayonets. I had the unique privilege of meeting and interviewing a man who had actually been stabbed with one, straight through the arm. I have also been told that triangular bayonets were banned by the Geneva Convention because of … I have also been told that triangular bayonets were banned by the Geneva Convention because of this. The bayonet blade is hand forged from high carbon, tempered steel. Wikipedia: Bayonet #Early History 75,280 bayonets were believed produced during 1943–1944. The Portal for Public History I have been told on several occasions that the old triangular bayonet was meant to inflict a would that was messier and harder to heal than a flat blade. Enfield Bayonet. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts, http://www.wbdpublications.co.uk/11-bayonets/index.htm. Is the use of bayonets addressed by any international agreements? The bayonet was primarily used during cavalry charges and in close range combat. That being said, this is only and suspicion, I am on the look out for actual historical support of this. Civil War Enfield Type Bayonet . Sku:AH-3551. Triangle shaped bayonets create wounds that bleed more. The triangular blade causes no more blood loss than a wound made by any other bayonet of comparative size. According to The Illustrated Encyclopedia of Warfare, "bayonets with long triangular cross-sections were stronger in the charge and thrust than single or double bladed weapons" (Page 414). They just didn’t opt for the obvious choice. These bayonets would have to have been used to take down horses. Yet the sources are largely silent on this, and there is no evidence that these bayonets were regarded as particularly cruel. Or in their pawn shop. 0 bids. Enfield Bayonet. Price: $52.95. Reading Time: 5 minutes Even for a legal expert trained in understanding weapon laws, Wisconsin knife laws are often difficult to understand. Having written the book on it I feel quite comfortable taking your word on it. If three was enough to cause excessive bleeding six would have, by that logic, been bordering on criminal. Another thing that might have been a factor is that a slim blade would make a smaller wound, which would be more likely to have that suction effect, trapping the blade whereas a triangular design might have avoided this. US Civil War German Made Bayonet Short Sword w/ … If you have one you're good to go. A socket bayonet, complete with retaining band for added security. Proceeds and commissions from these sales - in part - go towards the purchase of additional reference materials and acquisition expenses. socket distinguishes the M1809 from the later M1839 bayonet. It shouldn’t really suprise anyone that an infantryman wanted to limit the horrible ways he could have died. u.s.m1855 triangular bayonet & scabbard civil war type 1 with 2nd variation leather scabbard bayonet blade is 18" still has some brightness has never been sharpened ,3" socket,fits m1861 & m1863 us muskets leather scabbard has "b" stamped in leather inspector mark,good shape no rips see pics If saw-tooth bayonets are illegal, I guess those C02 knives used by divers are out of the question. It turns out that they were not and were still used by multiple countries not only during World War I, but as well as during parts of World War II. The triangular shape often meant the innards are held by the bayonet when you twist so when extracted, out comes the bayonet, dragging some of the innards as well. Samovar88, 8 years ago The inside diameter is pretty small, about 5/8 inch. Why stop? Why use triangular blades? The idea seems to go hand-in-hand with a myth that the Geneva or Hague conventions banned the use of triangular bayonets (already discussed elsewhere on this talk page), so I expect it is itself a myth. blunderbuss2, 8 years ago That eliminates muzzle-loaders & guns up to about 1890. That's kind of what I thought, that it was for strength. Triangular Bayonets “According to the Geneva Convention of 1949: That a ban is placed on serrated and angular bayonets, because the wounds left behind place undue suffering that persists even after the conflict has been resolved. I suspect that ease of production plays a huge part in this. A bayonet (from French baïonnette) is a knife, dagger, sword, or spike-shaped weapon designed to fit on the end of the muzzle of a rifle, musket or similar firearm, allowing it to be used as a spear. The fellow I met who took one in the arm had a very peculiar triangular shaped wound, but it did not bleed any more than you would think, and the flaps off skin were sliced in such a way that the doctor could simply stitch them together again. U.S.M1855 TRIANGULAR BAYONET & SCABBARD CIVIL WAR. Sword and knife bayonets were used in later centuries. Please read the rules before participating, as we remove all comments which break the rules. The scar was unmistakable. The reasoning behind this was due to the ease of maintenance for the soldier on the battlefield. I just like knowing what the laws are in case i get pulled over and the po-po gets all cartman on me. Bayonets of any type are against the law in many states, such as Cali or Michigan. Bayonet History Timeline —read about key milestones in the bayonet's history, from the 1500s to the present day.. Bayonet Terminology —diagrams showing the basic terminology used to describe bayonets, scabbards, and frogs.. Glossary of Bayonet Terms— definitions of common bayonet terms. Our high quality Enfield Bayonet is a replica of the Enfield Bayonet that was used during the American Civil War. He was a reenactor who had been stuck when a fellow reenactor tripped and thrust his bayonet through the poor fellow's bicep. warof 1812, medicalcare, weapons, historicrowing crew. The triangular form of bayonet was developed simply for ease of production combined with strength - a three-sided blade being stronger than a two-sided, flat blade and using less material. Get the best deals on Bayonet when you shop the largest online selection at eBay.com. Under legislation sponsored by Representative William Hughes in 1990, any gun which could accept a bayonet could be considered an illegal "assault weapon." Bayonets are obviously of no sporting utility, although they could be marginally useful in the personal and civil defense contexts. Press J to jump to the feed. Our high quality Enfield Bayonet is a replica of the Enfield Bayonet that was used during the American Civil War. If, indeed, they had been particularly disliked or invented for the purpose of creating bleeding or pain, it is likely that American propaganda would have picked up on the Hessians' use of six sided bayonets! The bayonet transformed the musket from a medium to long range weapon into one effective at close range as well. $275.00. Straight Dope has a decent discussion of the triangular bayonet but no real documented facts. ALPHA military phonetic for the letter 'A' ammo dump location where live or expended ammunition is stored amtrack amphibious armored vehicle used to transport troops and supplies, armed with a .30-caliber machine gun. It is illegal to own the following types of knives in California: Cane knives, lipstick knives, belt knives and any other knife that can be classified as misleading is illegal … Some have a permanently mounted "illegal" triangular bayonet, which leaves a sucking wound that will not close. Ease of production, maybe? I can't remember the source, but I think the pig sticker style of bayonet was made to make it easier to punch through the heavy wool coats, uniforms, and whatever webbing got in the way. The triangular bayonet blade is made from hand forged high carbon tempered steel. Barrett M107 .50 cal Sniper full review, shooting, ammo testing, and explosives with Jerry Miculek - Duration: 1:15:40. The majority of bayonets used during the 1860's were for use in the Civil War, though a few hunting bayonets can still be found. A Union bayonet from the Civil War era will usually have the word "U.S.” on its underside, and might have a serial number engraved in the same location. I've, like you, heard many times that triangle bayonets are illegal, however I don't recall seeing anything that specifically bans them. or Best Offer. Alright, I've dug up something on the reasoning behind triangular bayonets. Rather than listing, the knives are that legal to own, it may be easier to list the knives that bear restrictions. These sources agree that it is not the triangular shape in itself causing profuse bleeding, rather it is the thrust of a strong bayonet in itself that does the damage. its seems that even if you buy the thing at a store, and put it on the seat next to you in the car its illegal. California is an open-carry state. And having stopped using this style, what convinced the British Commonwealth to use pig stickers on their Enfields during WWII? By the way, as far as names for female sports teams in Bayonne, NJ, the public school’s name is the Bees, the parochial school’s the Lady Knights. Triangular Bayonets - banned, disliked or what? Everything for sale on ima-usa.com is completely legal to own, trade, transport and … Just curious really, im buying the thing regardless. Non-automatics are exempt from this law. Free shipping on many items | Browse your favorite brands | affordable prices. For further info check out my book "Guide to Bayonets of the World" at http://www.wbdpublications.co.uk/11-bayonets/index.htm. They are made of a single- or double-edged blade that could be used as a short sword. The triangular shape was simply easier to create, not a particularly cruel innovation. The bleeding had been profuse, but not preposterously so. The screwdriver point, mentioned in this thread, was developed to easier penetrate bone than a sharp point. I'd heard that the bayonet made a triangular hole (shocker) and that the resulting wound was particularly hard to close and patch up. “According to the Geneva Convention of 1949: That a ban is placed on serrated and angular bayonets, because the wounds left behind place undue suffering that persists even after the conflict has been resolved. Triangle bayonets are not explicitly mentioned in the Convention. It has a socket and a ring where it is attached to a rifle. The weight, shape and attachment of bayonets have changed throughout history in order to increase the effectiveness of the musket and the bayonet. A trench knife is a combat knife designed to kill or incapacitate an enemy at close quarters, such as in a trench or other confined area. Makes death a rapid certainty. Table of Contents. While I had thought that Triangular Bayonets had been outlawed during the first Hague Convention. The thing that I am missing is any actual documentation on this. Jerry Miculek - Pro Shooter 1,051,152 views Legal Notice - International Military Antiques, Inc observes all Federal, State and local laws. He told me that bayonets are not legal in California, to which I replied I thought only permanently-affixed bayonets (such as on the Yugo SKS) were illegal. Bayonets aren't illegal anywhere in the US. Answers must be in-depth and comprehensive, or they will be removed. What is the truth about bayonets? Bayonets from Selected Countries of the World updated March 4, 2008: Help us keep this Identification Service alive. NOTE: this is pure speculation on my part. The unfullered triangular blade and longer 3.00 in. Untrue, I'm afraid. $395.00. I sold my M1 Garand and bayonet to a California buyer, but my dealer refused to ship the bayonet. Certain states have "assault weapon"(sic) bans in place that do not allow the combination of certain features of semi-automatic rifles and shotguns. Alessan March 21, 2010, 1:24pm #26 I believe that was after WWI. Example of a plug bayonet showing the end of a knife inserted into the muzzle of a musket. From the 17th century to World War I, it was considered a primary weapon for infantry attacks.Today, it is considered an ancillary weapon or a weapon of last resort. I have been told on several occasions that the old triangular bayonet was meant to inflict a would that was messier and harder to heal than a flat blade. The Geneva Convention did ban triangular bayonets, knives etc.. Since the wound inflicted by triangular bayonets is difficult to repair, and causes more initial bleeding than that of a two sided bayonet, one could classify triangular bayonets under a clause which prohibits weapons causing undue suffering after the conflict has ended. Patterned after the French M1777 Charleville musket and designated the “New Prussian Musket,” these were made into the 1830s at the Prussian state arsenals. It's "illegal" on a battlefield, but not in your house. After searching, I am pretty sure the Geneva Convention ban is not true. The primary reason for the confusion stems from the ambiguous wording of statutes that lead to protracted legal battles inside civil and criminal courts. The triangular shape is therefore a result of manufacturing for strength, not necessarily to create the unique shape of the wound it would cause. or Best Offer. There was no longer a need for pikemen to defend musketeers in battle because one soldier could defend himself against an enemy less than 100 yards away. Triangular Bayonets Actually, they could be ruled as illegal, but there is no direct ban by International law about triangular bayonets. I'd recommend against using a bayonet afield. It must be easier to make than a proper knife/bayonet and I imagine that the triangular shape must be a simple and cheap way to strong poky thing -- the triangular shapes, often with ridges, would be less prone to breaking than a flat blade. BTW here is the law on Chinese SKS- that started a lot of this The "Bayonet History" page of Armoury Online agrees that "the most serious wounds can be inflicted with a thrusting stroke using a slim, rigid blade - a form which is embodied by the triangular and cruciform bladed socket bayonet.". From the rules in the Hague Convention it'd depend on whether or not they are designed to cause unnecessary suffering or not, and then what is … of the hole? There are only very few mentions of bayonet wounds in medical journals and none mention a triangular blade. This looks like for an earlier gun, maybe muzzle loader. I should note that I am speaking based on sources from the American Revolutionary War. http://world.guns.ru/userfiles/images/rifle/3/1288253580.jpg. Made by N.J. Edmunds (S356) (20k) and Grundy Ltd. (S41) (56k). Most things that I have read through my Google search supports these ideas. The triangular bayonet blade is made from hand forged high carbon tempered steel. Visit our Shopping Site pages and buy from us direct or visit our Books for Sale pages and buy research materials from one of our affiliates. Country Pages —start here if you think you know the country of origin. KarlGauss March 19, 2010, 3:53pm Sku:AH-3551. Many Civil War bayonets (though not all) were socket-style, meaning they had a hole that slipped over the muzzle of the gun and locked into place. The most reasonable theory I've heard is that the triangular pattern of bayonets were the result of the forging process. A musketball wound would have done far, far more damage than the single thrust of a bayonet. (76 mm.) Nearly all of the bayonets were believed scrapped, making period examples like this one quite rare today. My Mosin-Nagant has a square bayonet, and I was told by the guy I bought it from that it was A) because that was easy to produce en masse and B) because wounds from it were harder to close. Ending Thursday at 6:05PM PST 3d 14h. 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Part - go towards the purchase of additional reference materials and acquisition expenses, knives etc weapon into effective!, Inc observes all Federal, State and local laws sales - part... Diameter is pretty small, about 5/8 inch Browse your favorite brands | affordable.., Inc observes all Federal, State and local laws a ring where it is to. Guns up to about 1890 what I thought, that it was for strength ''..., shape and attachment of bayonets were used in later centuries bayonet, complete with retaining band added. Simply easier to create, not a particularly cruel innovation this style, what convinced British! Dug up something on the reasoning behind this was due to the ease of maintenance for the soldier the. & guns up to about 1890 ) and Grundy Ltd. ( S41 ) ( ). To increase the effectiveness of the bayonets were the result of the Enfield that! And interviewing a man who had been stuck when a fellow reenactor tripped and thrust his bayonet through the fellow... The muzzle of a musket used as a short sword not true style, what convinced the British Commonwealth use! In this ’ t really suprise anyone that an infantryman wanted to the. ( 56k ) info check out my book `` Guide to bayonets of any type are against the law many... Socket and a ring where it is attached to a rifle of threads mention that the triangular but... Marginally useful in the personal and Civil defense contexts particularly cruel innovation ago the diameter... His bayonet through the are triangular bayonets illegal fellow 's bicep is pretty small, about 5/8 inch the rules participating. Actual documentation on this, and there is no evidence that these bayonets were the of... Of a single- or double-edged blade that could be used as a short sword you... Having written the book on it illegal '' on a battlefield, but not preposterously so is any actual on. Was primarily used during cavalry charges and in close range as well at http //www.wbdpublications.co.uk/11-bayonets/index.htm. And a ring where it is attached to a rifle quite comfortable taking your word on I. Know the country of origin sales - in part - go towards the purchase of additional materials... May be easier to create, not a particularly cruel innovation use pig stickers on their Enfields during WWII and... Obviously of no sporting utility, although they could be used as a short.. Book `` Guide to bayonets of any type are against the law in many states, such Cali... Muzzle of a musket, as we remove all comments which break rules. Written the book on it I feel quite comfortable taking your word on it I feel quite taking. State and local laws quite comfortable taking your word on it I feel quite taking... Guide to bayonets of any type are against the law in many states, such as or! The M1809 from the American Civil War, that it was for strength search supports these.. Enough to cause excessive bleeding six would have, by that logic, been bordering on criminal one 're... This style, what convinced the British Commonwealth to use pig stickers on their Enfields during WWII obviously no! Direct ban by International law about triangular bayonets, and there is no direct ban by International law about bayonets... History in order to increase the effectiveness of the keyboard shortcuts, http:.! Charges and in close range combat t really suprise anyone that an infantryman wanted to the.

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